Blue olive badge serial numbers

The hope is that by using improved information better explanations can be developed. To place the unnumbered badges in proper context, we introduce each badge and discuss its position in the serial number scheme used by Ludwig. Ludwig simply did not use serial numbers at this time. Some modern reproductions of the Pre-Serial badge exist and period-correct badges are sometimes switched, so one should be careful to verify that the badge is original to the drum to which it is attached to avoid drawing incorrect conclusions.

When Ludwig starts using serial numbers, they are on the same style of badge as the Pre-Serial badge. The earliest date stamp documented on a drum with a K1 badge is October 10, During October — November , and occasionally afterwards, a drum may have received either the Pre-Serial or the K1 badge. At some point in the second half of , and at about serial number , the trademark registration symbol was added to the Keystone badge.

Because the same underlying style of badge was used for both Pre-Serial and K1 badges, a K1 badge without a serial number is likely just a Pre-Serial badge. Alternatively, it could also be a modern reproduction. It is likely not a rare example of a badge that failed to receive a serial number it was supposed to receive.

The K2 badge starts at about serial number and continues through about serial number The vast majority of the K2 badges appear on drums with date stamps from late through November There are relatively few Blank K2 badges documented. Modern reproductions of the K2 badge are available and sold openly and frequently. The reproductions do not have serial numbers, so look like Blank K2 badges.

One should be especially careful to verify that the badge is original to the drum to which it is attached to differentiate between legitimate Blank K2 badges and modern reproductions.

Blank K2 Badge. Photo by Mike Layton. Twenty-one different drums with Blank K2 badges are documented. Seventeen have date stamps from September 1, through September 8, One is documented with a date stamp month and day are not readable and three others are on drums without reported date stamps but possessing physical characteristics consistent with manufacture.

Most are reported to have the vent hole placed higher on the shell, which can result in the top of the badge being covered. One caution - with only 21 examples, and only 17 with complete date stamps, one cannot definitively conclude that all legitimate Blank K2 badges are on metal drums or have September , , date stamps.

More reports of drums with Blank K2 badges are needed to draw solid conclusions. In very late , Ludwig switched from the K2 badge to a parallelogram shaped badge with blue and olive coloring.

The upper right and lower left corners are pointed. The initial blue and olive badge did not have the trademark registration symbol on it.

The serial number sequence in use on K2 badges continues with BO1 badges, with the transition point being about number Serial numbers continue up to about on BO1 badges in about the middle of One hundred and thirty-nine BO1 badges without serial numbers are documented. Of these, have a date indicator of some sort — 84 with date stamps and 30 with Date Codes — while 25 do not.

Eighty of the date stamps are from and four from May A large group of these 59 are date stamped from September 8, to October 10, , while the 21 remaining drums from are spread from April 3, through December 16, The Date Codes on the 30 drums with them , , and appear to date from , starting in about May of that year. Of the drums with Blank BO1 badges where the shell type is known, shell type is distributed between metal 38 and wood The metal shelled drums with Blank BO1 badges have vent holes located well above the center bead, so the full-sized badge fits easily.

About 7. The large concentration of Blank BO1 badges in September 8 -October 10, is particularly interesting. As noted earlier, the Blank K2 badges have date stamps date from September , There is also a noticeable absence of reports of drums with serial numbers with date stamps from September 1 — October 9, This strongly suggests that Blank badges were used in lieu of badges with serial numbers during this time.

The reasons for this six-week phenomenon, which occurred almost a year after the K2 badge was discontinued and the BO1 badge was introduced, are not known. In about mid and at about serial number , Ludwig added the trademark registration symbol to the BO1 badge. Note that the next badge, with rounded corners and referred to as the BO3 badge, appears in about and at about serial number BO2 and BO3 badges are used concurrently for a few years. Because Ludwig ceased date stamping its drums before the debut of the BO2 badge, date stamps are not available to assist in the evaluation of the Blank BO2 badges.

It is believed that the Blank BO2 badges date from through the late s. The Blank BO2 badges are found on drums with Granitone interiors, drums with 2-hole black-faced P throw-offs, Vistalites and concert toms, which are all indicators that these drums are from or later.

The owner of one drum with a Blank BO2 badge possesses his original receipt dated May 4, The Blank BO2 badges are distributed between metal 27 , wood 17 and Vistalite 9 shelled drums. The metal shelled drums with Blank BO2 badges have vent holes located well above the center bead. Blank BO2 badges represent about 1.

Modern reproduction BO2 badges without serial numbers are readily available. The proliferation of reproduction BO2 badges may impact the integrity of the data about Blank BO2 badges and blur the already somewhat unclear situation.

Efforts were taken to remove drums with reproduction badges from the analysis. Five BO1 and ten BO2 badges are documented which have etched or hand-engraved numbers in the area where stamped serial numbers were normally placed. It is unclear if any or all of these left the factory with the etched numbers.

Two Etched BO1 badges numbers and are date stamped in June and three Etched BO1 badges numbers , , are date stamped in September Part I of the paper reviews the previously published information designed to aid in date estimation. The construction of each is analyzed and strengths and limitations are identified.

Part II presents two newly developed Dating Guides for main line drums: the first covers when date stamps were actively used and the second covers after date stamps are discontinued. Part III suggests approximate dates and serial number ranges for several changes in physical characteristics, including milestones like: 1. Part III culminates in a detailed summary table that lists the serial number and date ranges when changes in physical characteristics occur.

This table should provide a starting point for the authentication of vintage Ludwig drums made from Always mindful that exceptions occur, this table should be just one of the tools that one uses. Part IV of the paper provides a dating guide and analysis of changing physical characteristics for Ludwig's second line Standard drums, Many players seeking the vintage Ludwig sound find Standards to be affordable alternatives to the more expensive main line of Ludwig drums.

Although Standards were marketed as second line drums, the wood shells were the same as used on the main line of drums. Different wraps, hardware and interior finishes were utilized to distinguish them from the "regular" Ludwigs.

This is likely in part because of relatively low interest due to their "budget" nature and relatively short period on production. Until now, dating of Ludwig Standards represented another gap in the information available to the vintage drum enthusiast.

As of December 10, , drums are recorded, with 75 reliable reports of drums with both serial numbers and date stamps, There are 20 drums with serial numbers and labels with date codes. Ant help greatly appreciated!! Osahead2 DFO Master. Hmm, without any photos, I would say Oct to Nov when they where made. Joined Jan 4, Messages 31, Reaction score 1, Dating Blue Olive Ludwigs will only lead to heartbreak In the Ludwig Book by Rob Cook, badges without serial numbers were from However nothing would surprise me with Ludwig.

I have a 22x14 bass drum with this badge, in sparkling burgundy pearl. Which was not available in the catalog. Bun Carlos Pro. Joined Dec 23, Messages 3, Reaction score 1, In the dating guide book it also says some were made around ?

A very interesting reference book. Bun Carlos said:. Click to expand I have a section on the topic of blank badges. I try to differentiate based upon the badge style with or without the trademark registration symbol and also the ones that have been trimmed. Always remember that I am only reporting info I have gathered and try to avoid presenting anything as absolutely definitive. I am always looking for new reports of drums so that we can document what was produced.

Rob Cook indicates that there are some blank badges from later times, including Vistalies and some B stock drums. I do not have data on these, so cannot add to the discussion. KCDrumDad said:. GoJaskill Very well Known Member. I have some info, guys!! Okay, so i'm in the middle of purchasing a 3-ply granitone kit that was bought new in dude has the receipt. Three of the drums were special order pieces, and I guess because of that, they don't have serial numbers. They rest of the kit does.